Stand up comedian and women’s football content creator, Courtney Buchner, talks about her recent ADHD diagnosis, on the latest episode of The Level Playing Field Podcast.
In conversation with the the charity’s fans liaison officer, Liam Bird, Courtney discusses getting into football and her journey of self-discovery, which has come through exploring neurodiversity as an adult.
The podcast episode can be found here, or via your chosen podcast platform and the full transcript is available below.
You can find out more about Courtney on her Instagram and TikTok accounts.
Liam: Hello and welcome to the Level Playing Field Podcast. The podcast from the disability charity Level Playing Field, who advocates for disabled people to access and watch live sport. My name is Liam Bird and I’m very excited to share today’s episode with you.
My guest is Courtney Buckner, a passionate content creator, uh, football enthusiast, a comedian as well as someone who has ADHD. Courtney was only recently diagnosed with huh, her adhd and in this conversation she shares how coming to terms with huh, her diagnosis has been a journey of exploration and acceptance, with attending live sport playing a meaningful role in that journey. So let’s dive into my chat with Courtney joining me by the power that is the Internet. Courtney, how are you?
Courtney: I’m good, thanks. Um, um, yeah, I’m feeling really good. It’s a Monday, I’m getting my brain switched on. Sometimes it takes me a little bit longer to like transition from weekend mode into like working mode and not make that transition. Super anxiety inducing when I’m like all of a sudden going from a relaxed state to being like. And the working week begins. But I’m good. How are you doing?
Liam: I’m doing very well, thank you. I always find that you kind of either have to have like a cold shower start to your week, whereby it’s just like a shunt and then you’re in, or it is that kind of slow burn that you’re not really getting going until maybe Tuesday afternoon. And, um, then, um, then you get going.
Courtney: Yes.
Liam: Yeah.
Courtney: I, I’m a, I’m a fan of the slow morning start. So I realised very quickly, like, for my brain, I don’t really like things to be, to feel like they’re rushed. So I’m a fan of waking up a little bit earlier so that I can like sit and watch an episode of like a funny TV show for 20 minutes on eating breakfast or something like that. So I’m definitely more of a slow morning star.
Liam: I think it’d be interesting for people, uh, listening to get a better understanding of yourself. Um, how did you get into sport if you’re okay talking about your own disability? And when was it that you realised, oh, I actually really enjoy going to watch football.
Courtney: So first of all, I had a very interesting discovery this week after seeing your email and I. So I’m neurodiverse, I have ADHD and I didn’t realise that ADHD is classified by the UK government as a disability until you had mentioned it. And it’s really interesting because now this has started me on my own journey of like realising different aspects. I Was diagnosed at the beginning of this year and I just never realised that until we had had a conversation. So this is also going to be a podcast of me discovering things.
Liam: Yeah.
Courtney: AndI guess that’s a lot of my content as well, but. Sorry, your question was about how I got into football, correct?
Liam: Correct.
Courtney: Great. I’m probably going to go on a lot of tangents. So I got into football really at a young age. I had three older brothers who all supported a different team. Hilariously, my oldest brother supports Liverpool, middle brother Man United and youngest brother Arsenal, and my dad supported Chelsea. So we were in a house of extremes. When I was younger. They gave me Newcastle because they were like, oh, we’ll just give her a different one as well. So I’m from South Africa originally, which meant we didn’t really have, like an alliance to a location, so we all just ended up picking any team. Then I ended up moving to the UK and I started to go to Arsenal games with my dad and my youngest brother. I was interested, but, like, I got distracted, like I think many young girls do with other things that were just more important. And I kind of lost that love of sport in a way. And I think that happens to a lot of young girls who become a teenager and sport becomes less of a priority. And then it was kind of with the Women’s World cup that I kind of. Well, the Euros win, obviously, was massive. Like, I watched that and I was a little bit intrigued. And then the Women’s World cup happened and all of a sudden it was just like having a whole new community, like, surprised me. I just like, of course it existed, but it just, like, I just didn’t know. And then all of a sudden I saw the community and I was like, this is something I want to be a part of. And, um, it kind of coincided that what had happened is I’m a writer as well, so I write comedy and I do stand up comedy. And I really wanted to write a TV show about women’s football, but I realised I’ve hardly played, like, I played when I was younger. I have known nothing about the ins and outs of women’s football. And so I started researching it and I got in touch with a few different teams in the UK and they were really kind and they let me go and actually, like, interview players and see what training’s like. And so while I was, like, watching the World Cup, I was also working on a TV pilot about it. And it’s like the two things kind of happened together to just introduce me to A whole new side of the world that I didn’t know.
Liam: So when you said the Women’s World cup, do you mean the one that happened recently in Australia and New Zealand?
Courtney: Yeah, that one.
Liam: Okay. Yeah, Just for time, just so people are aware of. Yeah. Where we’re talking about. Okay. There’s a couple of things that I want to pick up there. Was your love of sport – was that kind of forced upon you on your family or was it something you came to you naturally ‘oh, my brothers and my dad are going to football, I also want to go.’ Or was it, you’re coming with me, we’re going to watch it?
Courtney: Oh, really? Okay, that’s a really interesting question. So growing up in South Africa till I was 14, sport is an absolute must in schools in terms of like, you will do your sport in your classes and you’ll also have extracurricular. And I play played football as my extracurricular sport. And I think a lot of that was just because growing up with three older brothers, there was never a reason why I wouldn’t have been in the football team. I was in the boys football team, but I had three older brothers who put me in goal all the time. So I was kind of like, well, this is just the norm for my family that I would play football. That’s the sport that they all do. And I really wanted to like. It was something that I felt like, okay, well I can play with my brothers, so why wouldn’t I want to do it at school? Probably a big part of it was I saw my brothers bonding with my dad about football and I wanted to be there. I wanted to sit on the sofa and shout at a screen and have a team that I supported. So I think it was a combined thing of I grew up in a country where sport was really encouraged and also in a family where there wasn’t really the dynamic of, oh, girls don’t play football. It was very much like, you get in goal, we’re going to pelt this ball at you as fast as we can. And I just got used to it.
Liam: Survive or not.
Courtney: Honestly, I vividly remember I had like a 11th birthday party and it was disco themed and I was like, this is great, I’m having a disco. And for some reason, my 11th birthday party, we stopped the DJ and we all played a football game instead. And I was in goals and it was all of my brother’s friends, like hursting a ball at me for my 11th birthday and I was petrified. But it was one of those, like being in goals and Having three brothers hurtful balls at you at top speed. It shapes you. Definitely shapes you.
Liam: Definitely going to shape you. If you don’t mind, can we talk a little bit about your, um, adhd? Because you said that you only got diagnosed this this year or last year?
Courtney Last year. So it would have been last year. It took me about a year waiting, like for referral, and then it was last year that I got diagnosed.
Liam: And what made you want to kind of dig into that a little bit yourself to see if there was any diagnosis?
Courtney: Oh, such an. I love these questions. So essentially I had always felt like, um, my brain worked in a different way and, ah, I could never really pinpoint why that was or how to kind of support it. I just knew that I was like, oh, okay, this is just a trait of mine. Um, and then I met a friend who, she works for a charity called Neurodiverse Sport, mainly looking at athletes who are neurodiverse and she’s neurodiverse as well. And when I was speaking to her, so much of what she shared really resonated with me. And then I obviously got to that point where I thought, okay, I’m. I’m fairly certain I have adhd. And I was contemplating, like, whether I needed a formal diagnosis or not. And I know a lot of people choose to have a formal diagnosis. A lot of people choose to not go through that route. But for me it kind of came. I sat with it for a really long time and kind of came down to the idea that for me it was really important to have a formal diagnosis because I almost felt like it would help me understand myself better. And I wanted that reassurance that it wasn’t just coming from me. I think having years of, like, gaslighting yourself essentially into trying to fit moulds or being like, no, no, no, this, I. I’m fine. I just need to work harder or do better or like, fight against my own brain. I kind of just felt like I needed to go through the diagnosis process to just have a little bit more confidence to tell younger me, okay, it’s fine, like someone else is with you on this journey. And, um, then that’s kind of why I decided to go that route and get a diagnosis, I guess.
Liam: So that’s interesting because your journey’s a little similar to mine, whereby I’ve always had severe dyslexia that’s being diagnosed. I have a heart condition, but I’ve always found myself really difficult in social situations and also really difficult at times with crowds and noises and lights. And I just thought that, well, that’s my personality. And through being at Level Playing Field, I realised, oh, these are autistic traits. And I was like, oh, am I autistic? Is this a thing? So I did the same. I went through the process and was diagnosed as autistic. And it has – It’s really weird to explain, I think, to anyone who hasn’t gone through that journey of how much it is like ‘oh, this makes sense’. Everything in my life now makes sense. Why things have been difficult at times, why sometimes I seem really agitated and I’ve lashed out at someone because I’m in an area whereabouts I don’t know, I don’t feel comfortable, I don’t know where the exit signs are. I’m really panicking. But why am I panicking? Now I know why I’m panicking. So I can kind of prepare myself if I’m going to those environments. But that’s kind of leading to my next question then. Has your ADHD before your diagnosis or, um, after? Has it affected how you attend Life Sport and how you’ve kind of maybe protected yourself when going.
Courtney: I’m sorry. Obviously, as a podcast people can’t see that I’m like, holding my heart. I so resonate with that. Like, I think with ADHD, before and after having my diagnosis, what I’ve discovered is more compassion for myself. And almost I had that moment where all of those things that I did that I tried to stop or would beat myself up about after happening. So let’s say I went to a social interaction and it was overstimulating and I maybe, like, went internal or felt very anxious. I would go home and be like, why am I like this? And beat myself up about those things. Whereas now I am so much more accepting of myself. It’s. And other people around me have. Have been accepting of that before and after diagnosis. My friends, my close friends accept me exactly the same. But I’ve become so much more compassionate to be like, oh, I know that becoming overstimulated in this environment is not a fault, it’s not a flaw. I don’t need to change it, I don’t need to beat myself up about it. But I can put things in place now that I’ve accepted it’s a part of who I am. And I think a lot of it was like, accepting that that was a part of who I am and I no longer try to change it. But I could be better prepared for it, if that makes any sense.
Liam: Yes. Yeah. Uh, 100%. So I suppose my question then is how do you prepare yourself now if you know you’re going in environments whereabouts it might be a little overwhelming, or whereabouts you yourself might act not yourself, if that makes sense.
Courtney: No, it makes complete sense. It took me. You know what’s interesting is, despite knowing that I did find certain environments overstimulating, I started going to football games live after my diagnosis. So I’d gone to theatres, I’d gone to places with crowds, but football, it took me a really long time to realise the stadium really triggers me. And I fought that realisation for a really long time. Because essentially what I do is I’d sit right at the top where there was like minimal people, a lot less crowds, and then all of a sudden my friends who I made through football would be like, come and sit at the bottom. Then I’d sit at the bottom and there’d be all this chanting about me. And I couldn’t put the two and two together that I was like, oh, I’m in a different environment that’s stimulated in a different way. There’s so much energy from people, there’s so much chanting, everything’s going on. And it took me a really long time to realise I needed to prepare for those environments, that I needed to make those preparations. And so now what I do is I first of all started wearing headphones, but they were just like normal music headphones. And I was like, okay, that’s not enough. And then I bought like in ear noise cancelling reducing ones, but hilariously found out halfway through I was like, okay, they’re good at reducing the noise, but I don’t like the texture or like the feeling of them in my ears. Which was really frustrating because then I was like, okay, well, a part of me was really hesitant to get over ear noise cancelling headphones. And I think the reason why I was hesitant is I felt like it would draw more attention to me. But so far, like, I’ve now used them now and everyone around me has been really compassionate and really understanding. And I also, like, I’d get frustrated at, uh, having to have to remove them to hear what people are saying. But it’s so much better for me because I can actually be really present when people are talking to me. Whereas before when I didn’t use them, yeah, I could hear them, but I just internally felt so removed from the moment.
Liam: So what was the thing that made you think that having canned kind of ear defenders would be, um, a thing to be targeted?
Courtney: What do you mean?
Liam: I’ve rephrased my question because the sport has done a lot regarding, um, autism and ear defenders and how much ear defenders can really support autistic people. It seems that a lot of players now will walk out on ear defenders. Paul Mullin was probably the most famous one recently where basically came out with another kid who’s wearing ear defenders. And I think ear defenders are great. They do the thing that they need to do. However, I think the association with ear defenders have come to children and not with adults. So what I suppose my question is like, did that insecurity come from the fact of, oh, I feel like a child?
Courtney: Oh, my gosh, you hit the nail on the head. I felt really young m and I felt really like, yeah, I guess childlike in a way, like, oh, I’m taking out these and children need them and so do I. And I think you’re correct. I think it is something that I had previously associated with children. And that was probably why I was so hesitant because I know a lot of adults use in ear ones and that was probably linked to why I was maybe a little bit more hesitant to use them. That’s really interesting. I’d never really connected it.
Liam: It’s one of my pet peeves in life of that certain disabilities people associate with different ages. So ambulance disabled older, autism younger. But it’s not like the moment you hit 16, your, your, your autism disappears. It’s still there. Like it’s still going to be a part of you as a person. So why do we, why do we make sensory rooms for children? Sensory rooms should be for everyone, but yet we market them. And it’s that mindset again of age and disability. That’s why I was interested of the question of ear defend, how you might feel uncomfortable because I think the public perception is ear defenders are for children. You should grow out of that. Uh, of course you don’t.
Courtney: That is so true. But I also think there’s such a market with in ear ones that they’ve become like, they are really pretty. Like, there’s ones that are really fashionable and they look like kind of earrings in a way. Whereas I haven’t found ones that are overhead that maybe are cooler and don’t just look like. I don’t know, I don’t know. And also I’m thinking about like the fidget spinners or things that I used to, like, play with. They are inherently childlike. When I went to an event, they gave me a feel and I was like, oh, this is really fun. But actually it’s not very different to what my niece is playing with. And, uh, that’s so interesting.
Liam: Kind of moving away from your experience as a disabled fan. Do you mind the term as a disabled fan? Like, do you consider yourself to have a disability?
Courtney: I don’t consider myself to have a disability. It was something I was thinking about this morning in preparation for our conversation because, as I said, like, I didn’t realise and maybe that’s a lack of awareness or a lack of, uh, maybe I should research. I’m not entirely sure, but I feel like there is so much more for me to figure out about how I relate to my identity as someone with adhd, just in the fact that I didn’t even realise that it is classified as a disability in the uk. But no, for me personally, I don’t identify as a disabled person. Whether that identity shifts and changes the more I experience life now as a person who identifies as someone with adhd, I understand that also, like, it shifts and changes all the time, your identity and how you especially depending on the experiences you have. Um, I do think I’ve been quite lucky in some ways that a lot of my experiences have been met with like, compassion and the people who have been around me have been amazing at meeting me where I am on this journey and responding to what I needed at, uh, specific times.
Liam: How is your relationship with football kind of influence your work as a content creator? Do you find that your perspective brings a unique angle to your football related content? And I’m kind of doubling on that, the intersectionality of it all, also being a female fan.
Courtney: So interestingly, I started creating content mainly because I was so interested in football. So a lot of people who look at my Instagram might not be aware of that. But, like, my content creation journey started because I fell in love with football and I wanted to create content about it. Um, I think what I found interesting is obviously creating content about football. Usually it means I’m at the games and recently it’s been very hard for me to get to games because I felt quite anxious about going into those environments. And that’s really hard to juggle as being like, I want to create content at the games, but actually what I’m really excited to explore is what kind of not even explore, just to represent is that you can be just as good of a fan and watch from home and not be at every single game because there are so many reasons that people can’t make it to a game. And that does not make you any less of a fan if you’re sitting in the Comforts of your family room, watching it, shouting at the TV alone. I think being a woman in terms of football and content creation, I’m really excited to see where the game goes and I’m really excited to see what having this space for women as fans like, not even. I think it’s really interesting in terms of having the growth of m female football for footballers, but I’m really interested in seeing how giving women a space to be a fan shifts and changes. Like, I don’t know about everyone else that can only speak from my experience, but there’s, there’s not many spaces, I think, as a woman where we can sit and shout and scream and chant in that way. And I think that’s what I find so interesting about being a woman and a football fan is this is the first time I’ve used my voice in that way. And I think that’s for a lot of other women. And I’m really excited to see where that takes us. Like when we access that part of what it means to be human, that almost that competition, that aggression, that like fierceness and that fierce belief that I think a lot of boys have had since they were seven or been allowed to express and say, we were seven every time they go to a game. Now you have women in their 20s, 30s doing that and discovering that part of themselves. And I think it’s really exciting. And the one thing I love about being a woman in football is I get to express that. I think what’s been really interesting in terms of creating content as a, uh, fan with ADHD is sharing about how live sport can be intimidating to go to or can have obstacles that people maybe don’t even think about if they don’t necessarily have that experience or that, that specific brain, um, and how we can make it better for people. And I also think there’s something for me, at least what I was so conscious about being a fan who’s neurodiverse was. And this is, I think, a societal thing as well. Like, I’m aware of it all the time, is not coming across as rude when I’m overstimulated and I do try to do posts where I’m like, I am overstimulated at games, I wear headphones, I do all these things if you see me. And maybe I don’t interact straight away. This is why. And I think there is. I want to make a space where that’s acknowledged and also accepted that like, especially as a content creator, sometimes I’ll go to a game and people want to have photos and chat with me. And I adore it. Like, I love meeting people who are either fans of my comedy or fans of my football content. It’s amazing. And that’s why sometimes I find it painful where I know I’m not in that space to meet them the way I want to meet them. And so I want to make that message very clear that, like, there are other things underneath that. When you meet someone for the first time at a football game, lots of things are going on. Like, I went to a game, um, one of the Arsenal games, and I bought a ticket at the, like, avid fan supporter group. I didn’t realise that’s where they were, so I just bought a ticket lower down and all of a sudden I found myself in the middle of the, like, Arsenal supporters group. And they chart.
Liam: Is this men’s or women’s?
Courtney: This is for the women’s team.
Liam: Yep.
Courtney: And, um, they obviously chant for the whole game, which is amazing. And it’s such a, like, amazing thing to see. And I’d seen it from above when I was sitting in the stands at the top, but I’d never been in it. And all of a sudden I was in the middle and I didn’t have my headphones because at the time I hadn’t quite realised yet. And all of a sudden I just felt this wave of wanting to cry and I had this panic because I was like, I’m here. I’m like, I’m usually enjoying this. I don’t understand. And it’s like my brain couldn’t compute what was going on. And so I took myself to the bathroom and, like, I remember sitting in the bathroom and I was like, I just need to cry and I just need to get out of my system. And I did that. And then I returned back to the seat and someone next to me was like, oh, I love your content. And I was like, oh, thanks so much. And they, they asked, oh, are you okay? Like, you’ve, like, how’s. How’s the game? You enjoying this half time? And I was like, oh, actually, I’m feeling a little bit overwhelmed. And they were like, no, I completely get that. Like, there’s never any pressure to join in on the charts. Like, it was really nice to be met with someone who just was like, oh, do you want to go get a water? We could just sit for a bit. And so far, my experience of the Arsenal women’s fans has been that, uh. And I feel so lucky. Um, but it is hard in those moments where especially, like, for me, at the time I was looking around at everyone else. I don’t know why I’m getting emotional about it now, but, like, I was looking around at everyone else and they were all chanting and, like, enjoying the game. And I felt like, why, uh, can’t I do that? And I had this. Even though, like, I feel a lot more compassionate towards myself, there are still moments where I’m like, annoyed, I guess. I’m like, oh, I want to be the person who’s chanting the whole game, not who’s having to take themselves to the bathroom because it’s overwhelming. And so I do think with content, like, I tried to talk about that because I know that there’s probably someone else there feeling very similar and they’re not alone and I’m not alone. But yeah, even though I feel compassionate, there are still moments where I’m like, oh.
Courtney: What I would probably link that to is the kind of. I’m sure you’ve heard this, but the medical model and social model of disability. The medical model, okay, so the medical model that you kind of spoke about there was, why do I feel like this? Why can’t I be a part of what’s going on? The social model is, well, you can be a part of that. You just need additional tools to allow you, which are those ear defenders. So that’s the social model of disability. That’s what we at level playing field advocate for. The really simplistic way of looking at it is if you’re a wheelchair user, it’s a step, is the thing that’s disabling you, not you in a wheelchair, you in a wheelchair. So it’s kind of empowering the disabled person to live their life and realise that society themselves has kind of let them down to a point. So that’s the social model of disability. But yeah, it’s just more of a comment. There’s no question on the back of that, but it just sounded like you kind of medical modelled yourself there of, I’m the issue, you’re not the issue. Society is the issue that hasn’t provided you with ear defenders. That kind of links onto my question then. Your content is at football sometimes and you talk about kind of what it’s like to go to football or you’re talking to fellow supporters or players or whatever. Do you feel disability is actually spoken about in the same prevalence as other, uh, equality sectors? So what I mean by that is race, sexuality, gender, uh, that’s a very.
Courtney: Big question and I’ve got lots of thoughts going on in my head about it. Because I think, mainly, I think I can. My experience of football is largely watching the women’s game. And I think there is a very big difference between what we talk about in the women’s game and what we talk about in the men’s, and what is normalised in the women’s game and what’s normalised in the men’s. For example, like in terms of sexuality, in the women’s game, there is a high percentage of players who are openly out and great representation for lgbtq. Obviously, we know that in the men’s game, that is not the same. I feel like within the women’s game, at least, uh, from my experience as also a queer woman, it is almost one of the first spaces I discovered as a queer woman that felt really safe. And I think that is largely to do with representation. And I think it is something that is spoken about in a positive way. But also sometimes what I find fascinating, what I love about the space in football, about what, uh, I love about the space that women’s football has provided, is sometimes the queerness of the players is never spoken about, it just is. And I think that’s when you get to a point where actually that’s what you want. They are queer football players, but they are football players. And just by being on that pitch, that is representation enough. And I. I really respect that. And I found it amazing having that space as a queer woman in terms of race. You can just look at the Arsenal team and the Arsenal women’s team and see that there is a problem in terms of representation. And I know people have started to speak on it more. And I think the best way to have these conversations is with people who have the experience of the marginalised group that we are talking about, which is something I always try to do, is like to. To have these conversations about experiences that I don’t have. I think in terms of disability, it’s not something I’ve heard spoken about at all personally. And I think it’s very interesting to me because recently I was talking to a friend about neurodiversity and the statistics of how many people are neurodiverse and yet how many footballers are, I guess, out as neurodiverse is very small. And those numbers just don’t make sense, really. And it’s something that I’m really interested in as to why, if they are neurodiverse, maybe they don’t feel comfortable sharing that, or maybe we just don’t have the right systems in place where they even realise it’s. I spoke to a, um, footballer who was adhd and they were talking about, like, what kind of systems they need in place for training to be better for them, like, how they need to go over training. Um, sorry, you can tell I’m not a footballer because, like, what their activities are, like, what the play is, like, oh, you’re going to pass to here and we’re going to do that. And, like, they might need more assistance embedding it into their memory. And I do think there is so much more room for conversation to be had about disability in football and neurodiversity in football, because personally, I haven’t heard it spoken much. Again, I always say this is. I’m open to being corrected and I’m also on my own learning journey, but I don’t know many footballers who are really out as being neurodiverse.
Liam: But do you think that’s because disability is still quite a taboo subject matter, especially for footballers? Whereabouts the inches of success is so small that anything that’s going to stop you from possibly progressing as a footballer, uh, is going to be the thing that you’re going to hide for yourself. So if you’ve got an old school coach who’s going to be like, old school mentality about being having a disability. Unfortunately, society still thinks having a disability means less than. We see that in language, we see that in abusive language. Usually if you’re abusing a player or referee. Unfortunately, disability language is used towards to essentially go, you are less than. So that mindset is still embedded in football. And I’d, um, be interested to know if you think that’s the reasoning, because I think you’re right. All these kind of social issues, especially in sport, are led by the players because it’s resonating with the players and because the players have such a huge profile with their fan base when they speak, fans usually listen. You always got that subsection of supporters who aren’t, but they do listen. And I feel that with disability that’s not happening because no one’s willing or open to come out. I mean, 1 in 12 men are colorblind, so that means there’s so many footballers who are colorblind, but no one’s going to talk about their being colorblind because of the fear of being told, well, that’s a barrier for you to be able to succeed in football, so, bye, bye. So just keep it to themselves and just try and essentially adapt to their surroundings.
Courtney: You’ve hit the nail on the head with so many things. I’m like, wow, I’ve never strung those sentence, those words together to form a sentence before, but it makes so much sense. I think it’s, it’s common that if you are told that X, Y and Z is going to. And I say this in quotation marks again, people can’t, can’t see my hands on a podcast, but hold you back in whatever way there is. I think we can see it, especially with the women’s game now with them getting more media attention. But there is. It’s scary to come out and say anything. I think when you come, when people who are footballers who have this media attention come out and they say anything thing they are opening themselves up to so much. And like, we can’t control the media, we can’t control social media as well, where X, Y and Z can have their say and comment on whatever they want. I mean, I know from my content, like I’ll have people comment being like, oh, another person who just wants to put ADHD as their identity and it’s a trend, it’s a fad or whatever it is. And I do appreciate that, like for footballers, that is times a thousand for them to make a statement. They are opening themselves up to so much and not everyone’s ready to do that on their journey. Especially at the beginning when you. I mean, I say this as well, like I said at the start, like, I am still discovering so much about myself and even doing a podcast like this, like, I’m nervous talking about my own experience because I get scared that I’m going to say something wrong or that doesn’t align with someone else’s experience but is my own. And I can only imagine that, like as a footballer, uh, that’s times a thousand, that when you just come on this journey and you’re still figuring things out to have people screenshot or take something you said in an interview out of context, when you’re just trying to be representative of an experience, it’s very scary.
Liam: Again, I think you’ve kind of hit on something there. I think the reason the disability isn’t spoken about so openly is because it’s complex. It’s so, so complex. So therefore the idea that you might say something incorrect or that’s not PC, or you might say something that someone else might push back because they’ve got the same disability, but they use different terminology. The way that I kind of see disability is that like your disability is your disability, you’re going to know it and you’re going to speak about it in your own way. If someone corrects you um, when they’re talking about their disability, then be respectful of that and then use the same language that they do. It’s the same with anything like transgender issues or anything like that. If a transgender person says, these are my pronouns, just use the pronouns. Even if you don’t understand it, just still do it. There’s no point of just being angry for angry sake if you don’t understand it. Like, it’s okay not to understand it.
Courtney: And I think. I think for me personally, we have umbrella terms, but there’s also. So it’s so important to acknowledge that whether it’s we’re talking about LGBTQ plus or we’re talking about neurodiversity, every experience is different. And it is okay for, like, my experience as an ADHD queer woman to be different to the person next to me who’s also an ADHD queer woman. We can have two different lived experiences of what that is and respect both. And I think when we get to that point where, like, someone else’s different experience doesn’t infringe on, we’re not saying that’s the only experience that you can have. We can have really open conversations and be like, wow, okay, actually, you experienced this, I experienced this. But in the middle, there’s actually this commonality of what people were thinking or feeling or how they treated us. And I think we can start. As you said, it’s so nuanced that, like, letting everyone speak about their own experience will just heighten that conversation and make us more open to listening.
Liam: Any final thoughts from yourself regarding your journey? What are you kind of looking forward to exploring? Going to sport. Are you going to start exploring other sports, for instance?
Courtney: Like, I’m so excited to explore other sports. Rugby is the next sport on my list.
Liam Which one?
Courtney: Men’s rugby?
Liam: league or union? There’s two rugbys.
Courtney: Okay, well, this is the thing. You can educate me, because I’m learning.
Liam: Oh, I’m the worst. Uh, don’t ask me about rugby. I just know that there’s two. I know that because I get told off all the time for saying the wrong rugby. We’ve got staff members who are fans of both, and they’re quite tribal about their own rugby. So, um, yeah, very much, kind of. I’ve got to tread carefully when I talk about rugby league or rugby union.
Courtney: Oh, I know this is a difference. Well, one of the things that I loved about getting into football is, obviously with ADHD, something that’s common, at least in my experience, is I pick up hobbies very quickly, and I love to be stimulating. I love to learn. And so, essentially, when I came into football, for the next six months of my life, all I did was consume football. I’m talking about, like, I watched every single documentary I could watch. I went to so many games. I was, like, learning. It was, like, my latest obsession. And now I’m really excited to do that for rugby, because I know nothing about rugby. And, um, I love that, like, I can look back at my journey with football and be like, oh, I started being like, I don’t know any of these rules. What is going on? People are just flying all over a field. It’s crazy. And now I know so, like, I know so much more. And so I’m really excited to do the same with rugby and be like, I don’t know any of these brawls. People are literally flying around the field being crazy. And by the end of six months, hopefully I’ll have a lot more knowledge.
Liam: Well, there you go. Anyone listening to this who wants to educate Courtney about rugby league or rugby union, please get in contact, because I am not that person. But, Courtney, thank you so much for spending time speaking to me. We really enjoyed it, and good luck in the Football Content Awards. I know you’re nominated.
Courtney: You, too, then. Good luck.
Liam: Yeah, we’re gonna lose anyway. It doesn’t really matter. Uh, thank you for your time.
Courtney: Thank you so much.
Liam: Thank you so much to Courtney for being so open and honest about herself and her adhd. If you’d like to know more about Courtney and her content, there are links in the episode description of this podcast. That’s it for this episode. If you’re going to a match day, please enjoy yourself. And until next time, bye.